Podcast S1:E6 - What’s a business that is Better Than Big? With Ashley Gartland
Connect with the wise and wonderful Ashley Gartland over on Instagram or on her website!
Show notes:
Ellie: Today we have one of my favorite entrepreneurs, Ashley Gartland.
Small business mentor and coach Ashley Gartland helps service based businesses. Streamline so that they can scale sustainably and build a business that makes the life and the lifestyle they desire possible. She runs her six figure business in 30 hours a week. Leaving her plenty of time to enjoy the good stuff in life. Like trail runs, reading and adventures with her family.
What I love about Ashley is that she's so honest. She is willing to break the mold. She has a brilliant mind. And is all about creating simple and streamlined businesses that serve your life.
The funny thing is we didn't make an online connection until well after I'd moved to Belfast. But Ashley and her family are actually based back in Portland, Oregon, where I spent about seven years. Before moving here. So it's really cool to have that connection and I'm hoping that next time we get to go home, I'll actually get to meet her in real life.
So without further ado, let's jump in.
Welcome Ashley. I'm so excited to have you here.
Ashley: Thank you for having me. I'm really excited for this conversation.
Ellie: Me too! So let's just start with the rapid fire round. First off, where are you from?
Ashley: I'm originally from Seattle Washington. I've been living in Portland, Oregon for more than a decade. So that's home now.
Ellie: Absolutely. I only lived there for seven years, but it was, like where I became an adult, so like living there from 18 to 25, I just it's home for me still, too.
Alright. And so what are your preferred pronouns?
Ashley: She/her/hers.
Ellie: Awesome. And when did you start your business?
Ashley: So I started my coaching practice about, it's probably been about six years ago now and it's my second business. So before that I ran a business as a freelance writer and editor, and really honed my chops in the service industry that way. And then I decided I wanted to do something that was a little bit more impactful that fit my lifestyle a little bit better at that point.
And coaching presented itself in this roundabout way as an opportunity and a path to go down. And so I started exploring that and I've definitely pivoted a couple of times in the coaching business, but I would say for the last three to four years, I've been really working with service-based business owners and focusing on helping them create the simple streamlined business that deeply serves their life.
Ellie: Fantastic. You've already answered the, how you started your business within that too! Bundling. All great. So what do you love about your coaching business?
Ashley: So I really love helping people be successful. I think there's probably no one who would say anything otherwise there, but what I love even more is when I see a client have that light bulb moment when they're like, "Oh, the way that I designed my business can make all the things I want possible."
So whether it's shifting their services around to give them more lifestyle freedom, or giving them the confidence to raise their prices to help them create more abundance in their life. Like I love helping them do those things, or even the really like, teeny wins would seem to send people to any wins, like a client who gets to go start doing hobbies again, or spend more time with their children or start taking care of their health again, because we've built a business that has spaciousness.
That's like the real exciting stuff for me.
Ellie: Yeah, I definitely get that. I think that every time I do one of these calls and I asked somebody it's the impact they get to make. It's how their work in turn makes somebody's life or business or day to day better. That's I think, especially in the service-based businesses, that's why we've chosen what we do.
Ashley: I totally get what you're saying, like making that impact and that's really the difference. Like I remember again and again, in my freelance writing business where I just kept saying this is a sexy business. I got to go to lots of fun events and you know test cocktails for a living. Like it was fun, but it didn't have that impact piece.
And even though that feels a little bit like cheesy, like that's the thing I was chasing was this ability to make a difference. And I had to figure out what that looked like to me, it's different for every service provider. But for me, like helping someone create a lifestyle is what I'm really about.
And for other people it's something completely different. But I think what we do is very different from why we do it and why we do it is usually what drives us.
Ellie Yeah. The why can be so important because I found in my business, I was really struggling to find for quite a long time, a way to serve the people I wanted to serve in a way that felt like I wasn't running myself ragged. And because connected with the people I wanted to work with really early on, and I found that I really enjoyed working with these really small businesses.
And then I was going, "Oh my gosh, I can have either a million small clients ongoing, or I can completely pivot and do this whole project basis thing." And that's really worked out for me. And I stuck with that. The whole reason I changed my entire business model was so that I could still work with the why, like who I want to work with. Right?
Ashley: Yeah, and that's such a good example of why I love working with service providers. Like I could help all different types of business models and business owners create businesses that start their life, but it's especially tricky and a little bit more complicated when you do work as well. One service provider or even a one to many service provider, because there's a lot of moving pieces.
And so that's why I like it. It's because there's so many places to dig in and so many opportunities for them.
Ellie: Yeah, I get that. I can see that.
So can you tell me a little bit about, we're going to dive into kind of the back end of your business.
One of the things I've been talking about a little bit more with people is what help they have in their business. Because I think sometimes, especially when my business is me and your business is you, sometimes it can be easy to overlook all the moving bits and parts and people that are helping us get there.
So your business is Ashley Gartland and my business is Calibrated Concepts. But I have, my assistant and I have software and things that I'm using. So can you say a little bit about the things that are making your business tick in the background and the people.
Ashley: Yeah. So I think that's really important for a couple of reasons.
One, because you're right, we just see the front facing stuff and we don't always recognize, who's supporting behind the scenes that enables a business to do many things well. And so I often see like solopreneurs trying to do many things well and burning out without recognizing that other people have a team helping them do it. And so they're comparing apples to oranges there.
So I think it's really important to talk transparently for that reason. And the other reason is because I think we sometimes hear "you need a team and you need to delegate more". And we assume that means we need to hire a bunch of people. And I found quite the opposite to be true, that I've really found a good kind of balance in my business with a small and very focused team. Highly supportive, just amazing people working with me. But that's been, I don't need to have tons and tons of team members, a few people really have worked well.
So for me, that looks like I have an online business manager who is just phenomenal. And she's been with me for quite a few years now, I think four. And she does a lot of like content repurposing for me, onboarding clients, some systems does some tech stuff. And then she has other members on her team and some of them also work at my business. So she has somebody who takes my podcast and I create all the content, I deliver it all and then they handle all the tech of it and the production side of it. So that's been really helpful in allowing me to do a podcast without working a ton more because if I was doing the tech, I'd be working a ton more.
And then the other person I really use on our team a lot is the designer. And so she's somebody who I can send a document, she turns it into a beautiful PDF. Or she does the graphics for my social media. So someone else is doing all those things. So those are the three main players on my team.
There's other people on my OBM's team that sometimes step in and do things, but that's, who's helping me behind the scenes. And the reason that I have those people. Behind the scenes. And that I've picked those specific things are, those are the things that are not in my wheelhouse that take me tons of time and that are going to take away from the things that I'm going to do best, which are coaching and content creation.
Ellie: What you've said is really interesting here - is that you've chosen to have it really small, but mighty team. And I would be similar in a sense where I really have, I have one assistant and then I sometimes will contract out specific things.
But I like that you also have the small, but mighty team, but they're all connected, which means that they're going to be communicating in the background because they all have a really good relationship and you're not managing their relationships within the business. You're the center cog, but they all mesh and communicate as well.
Ashley: Yeah. So I will talk I will talk with my podcast, the editor, like I'll leave him notes, but you're so right. That my OBM is the in-between right. She's the person who disseminates all the information out. And it used to be, my designer used to be independent. And so we would communicate independently and I, then I would do stuff with my OBM and then my designer joined my OBMs team, which is like the most amazing, perfect situation to have happened.
And so now everything goes to her. So that's. That was like a really, even though it's just one less piece of communication flying back and forth in your inbox, it has really been nice to just have one point person and here's what needs to happen. And so that's been fantastic. And then I wanted to point out what you said about the contractors.
That's the other way I'm able to get stuff done is I may not need someone on my business to do something all the time, but I may hire a contractor for a short, like sprint, like someone to do my website or, something to pitch in for something I can't do, but I don't necessarily need them on my team all the time.
Ellie: Yes, same. Having professionals in to do something that's going to take you. A really long time, or it's just going to take a certain type of energy that you don't have is sometimes the absolute right call.
Ashley: Yeah. And sometimes I think we look at the return on investment of that and we think how much money is this thing going to make me? But I think you also have to think about how much time it's going to save you. And then think about what you can do with that time.
Ellie: Yeah. I think that's something my husband and I talk quite a lot about is this idea of time and energy and money are all really the same thing. And you have to choose where you want to invest what, and really you can make more money, but you can't make more time and you can only really expend so much energy.
Yes. It like obviously tops back up, but really you have to think about which one of those areas you're going to spend . And I think it differs for everything. A real-world example in my own life, oftentimes, I will craft a gift. I could buy a gift, but I enjoy the process of spending the time.
And so like it, you have to enjoy it and it's a whole thing you really need to think it all through.
Ashley: Yeah, so true.
Ellie: And then the other thing around like the processes in your business, what simple systems are you using to do to do business with ease?
Ashley: Yeah. So this is not fancy or sexy or anything very complicated, but I use a lot of like templates and spreadsheets. And for a lot of things in my business, like the podcast and content creation, we use Google docs and Google sheets, and we use those to communicate with the team and tag each other and make comments and that's how the communication happens and we keep moving things forward.
And then I have a project management system that I use for planning the podcast and for planning out marketing. And then also for client stuff. I'm actually in the process of changing that because what I've recognized is there's a little bit of friction with the client management system I'm using right now.
And it's not that it's necessarily bad, but I could see that it could be so much better. And I've recognized that investing a little time and energy to switch that system is going and be really good for the new year.
Ellie: I love that. Because first off, first things first, like I love templates. I don't think there's anything in this world that I might love more than templates. I have them for everything. I create them and share them with my own community quite a lot, because they're just things that I've built in my business. Maybe the reason I love templates is because more than anything, I hate reinventing the wheel. If I send an email more than three times, I now have a template for it, because obviously I'm sending it enough that it warrants that
And then what else I love that you were saying is that you're investing time. You've been doing this now for quite a few years, and you've made some pivots and tweaks and changes in your business model and sometimes in some of your offerings, but you're not just saying "here's my system that allows me to work my 30 hours a week".
But also I'm going to make sure to improve it because it will help me. It will help my clients. It will help my team. And so spending that little bit of time kind of fine tuning our systems can be really important.
Ashley: Yeah. And it's something that for whatever reason, it's like spring cleaning, but in a different season, like every year, around the holidays, and when things start to slow down a little bit more in business is when I just do a quick check-in and see are these systems still working?
Are there things we could add to them? And I'm always doing those, month to month too, but this is the big picture stuff. And I think you have to be careful with switching, right? Like you could switch systems all the time and it might not serve you. But so for me, it's is this a bright, shiny object of a slightly better system? Or am I solving a real problem?
And someone asked me this great question the other day, when I was noodling on, do I want to switch my software, basically. And she said, "does your, does using this system create friction in your business?" And I was like, "yes, every day." And then I was like, okay. So if it creates friction every day, it makes sense to change.
If it was like, "eh, that's not really that big a deal", but this bright, shiny other new system and software looked good, probably wouldn't be changing.
Ellie: Yeah. I think that's definitely valuable. I think a lot of people hesitate once they get really ingrained in a system to shift things up, but I think that easily you can get bright, shiny object syndrome. I don't change my systems very often, or at least like the software that I'm using.
I do fine tune quite a lot, but what I've found is that I have accounts for the free trial for every software that's ever been created because I need to know. If it's going to be better or I am the geek around these things. It's what I do. But also like I do have a bit of that bright, shiny object syndrome, but I do weigh the costs of being like, it's probably really not worth switching everything in my life over to that.
Ashley: Yeah, it's discernment. And the other thing I want to say real quickly about systems that I think maybe doesn't get talked about a lot is I think a lot of us are looking for an all in one system that will do everything for us in our business. And there are systems that can do that.
And if it works for you great. But what we found in my business it's more effective for me and team is to find really specialized systems that are really good at what they're doing. So we have a different system or different software, for, contracts and invoicing and oh scheduling.
Like they're not all under one umbrella, so yeah, we have to log into each one independently, but they're really good at what they do. And so we've decided that's a better way for us to go personally. And I think that's a choice everyone gets to make.
Ellie: Yes. I know some people that really like the all in ones, but I found being a tech VA. I was in the back end of those quite often. And they can be really buggy because they are trying to do everything, and then they're ever expanding and changing things. Whereas the people that are picking one thing and doing it really well - you're right.
There's a benefit to having everything under one house. And so it is really choosing what's best in your business. I've opted in a similar way to you where I have a different software for a few different things in my business, but I would a hundred percent be with Dubsado right now, if I wasn't a hundred percent addicted to Freshbooks. Like I can't leave it. It's I use it for my project tracking. I use it for time tracking. I use it for invoicing, accounting. I use it for team management for tracking my team's hours. And it communicates with Squarespace so I can track any money coming in that way.
And it also like integrates with my email. So I can see client communications there. So the whole thing is there and I don't think I'll ever be able to leave. Like I just, I love it too much.
Ashley: It's such a good example of finding something you love and sticking with it.
Ellie: It's yeah, I'm obsessed with it so I could go on, but I won't make everyone listen to my obsession.
So speaking of these types of things, we're going to be talking a little bit more with you about creating simplified services and building your offers around your life, because that's pretty much your expertise at least when I think of you and all the emails I get from you, I've been on your list for years now. That's what I think of. Tell us a little bit about how you help people create simple and fulfilling businesses.
Ashley: Yeah. So it depends on, you know, which offer they're choosing with me like, which kind of coaching partnership. But basically the way that I work is I help people with the tangible and practical work, like refining their service offerings and creating really streamlined services. But also I help with the belief piece of it too, because there's often a mindset component.
They need to work on their boundaries or they need to work on learning to say no, or they don't trust that their services are good enough when they're pretty simple. They, they want to balloon them and have tons of things. That's like big picture. The work looks like tangible work, practical stuff, systems, service design, all that stuff, but also the beliefs.
And then as far as how I help people, I either work with people through a six month coaching partnership, where we are looking at the six different elements of a business that's better than big. And we're really looking at how do we simplify, streamline, refine, help you grow with more intention and ease and all of those areas.
Or I work with people through a coaching intensive and that's where a lot of the service work. So I work with a lot of people who just want help with their services and designing them to fit their life. And we do that through a two hour coaching intensive, where we look at all the aspects of your services.
And we ask the question - not just, is this a good service and is this providing value in this. industry that you're in, but we also look at, does this serve the life that you want to live? And does this allow you to do the work that's fulfilling to you and bring in the revenue that you want? So we look at all those moving pieces and honestly that service intensive is one of my favorite things to do.
Ellie: I can see why I listen to your podcast pretty often. And what I love is that you bring on guests quite often that were clients or are still clients sometimes. And listening to them. What I really find most, striking is that. You seem to be one of the few coaches at least that I see all the time.
And I guess, I have my own little bubble around me that have people that I've inter interact with. But one of the few coaches that is really about helping people find. A business model that suits them. So not necessarily one that is done in their industry sometimes. Not necessarily one. I think sometimes people and it, it's a case of things that we do in all of our life, but it's that we follow what we can see.
And it's sometimes hard to see a path forward or a different path if nobody's done it before in our industry or in our own little bubble. So you're really good at helping people see that the industry model, isn't always the model that you need to choose.
Ashley: Yeah. And sometimes it is right. Like sometimes it is the right fit for you, but the way that it's laid out in someone else's business, isn't exactly the way you need to do it. Like the features may mean you need to look a little bit different. That positioning needs to be a little different and you're totally right, I think the mistake is that a lot of us make is that we just look around to our peers and the people closest to us. And we're like, I'll just do what they say to do or our mentors. And we do that. And then we end up with a business model and services that don't quite fit. And we end up feeling like, "I don't love the business", but that's not really true.
Like a couple little tweaks, or sometimes a total reinvention of the services, can get you to the place where business is serving life again. And you're really loving the work.
Ellie: Yes. I think that's something that like a lot of my listeners really need to hear. And I think that because when starting a business, it can be really overwhelming to think outside the box or to think in this reverse way where we all start a business because. It's either. We really love what we do or we're trying to find the space for something else in our lives.
So we're trying to build our business around our life in a way, but then entrepreneurship can be all consuming if you let it be. Right? And so it's really thinking through those things that you're talking about, thinking through the boundaries, thinking through the potential tweaks or business model changes or messaging or positioning or whatever it is really important.
Ashley: Yeah, so true. A hundred percent.
Ellie: So, are there some simple steps that people can take in your mind to create more simple or easeful, fulfilling businesses?
Ashley: Yeah. So I think it can look and I think most people have a gut sense of what's the most important move for them. For some people, it is like a complete redesign from scratch. And those might be the people who picked the business model that other people said it was the right fit for their industry and have always felt a little resistance to doing work that way.
Like maybe somebody who's doing retainer services and is " no, I just really want to do short term projects with people", but has never felt like they have their permission to do that. So sometimes the step is giving yourself permission to seek a totally different business model and way of working.
The other option is looking at the small tweaks and I think we can really underestimate the impact of those and looking at little things like how you manage your client projects, what the features are of your services. And if you're feeling overwhelmed by the features, maybe you need to scale back some of those features, or maybe you need to change the timelines of your projects.
So those can be things to look at. So it's really looking at do I like the way that I'm working, but it's just feeling like I'm feeling a little friction and frustration around it or. Do I really not like the way that I'm working and I almost I'm ready to hang my hat. And that's when you know that you need to probably switch the business model completely, but it's a little different for everyone.
And that's why I think this work is so fun is it's really about figuring out what works for you. And I feel like that service intensive is really just a big, old permission slip to say, let's design the business to make it fit you in the way you want to work. And again, it can look different ways.
Ellie: That's amazing. I think the other thing is it's iterative, I started my business and honestly, for me my first business was, had nothing to do with really passion. It was entirely so that I could have a business that was remote. That was it. And so it took a lot of working with people, testing things, and then almost feeling stuck a couple of times into the work that I was doing. Before I went okay, I really do feel stuck, but I didn't know what I wanted at first. So I wasn't following a model for my dream business I was following a model of I'm going to be a VA because I knew I had those skills and that's it. And so then I was like, okay, I refined that because I want it to be a tech VA. I liked that. And then I found that it was really overwhelming to serve the people I wanted to serve in the way I wanted to serve them.
So then I was like, "okay, going to do one niche service. I'm going to make it project-based and I'm going to do it. And actually that has served me really well overall.
Ashley: I think that's such a good point, right? Because it sounds like your motive and your needs have changed too. Sometimes it's not that anything is. Broken in the business, but just that your life situation has changed or your desire for what the business can create for you is different. So that might be that you want to work more remotely.
It might be that you want to travel more. And so you need to switch from, again, the retainer to the short-term work. It might be that you become a parent and you need to have more flexibility in your services. There's just so many different things that you can do, but I love what you're pointing out there that sometimes it's not, again, not that something's broken, but maybe just that your needs and motives have changed.
So you need to, tweak the services to suit those things.
Ellie: Yeah, definitely.
All right. So let's dive a little more back into your business. What would you say is your biggest win in business so far?
Ashley: I think there's so many fun things that I could point to that I've been able to do. But the number one thing that I keep coming back to is that over the past, I don't know now, like 13 years if I'm counting both businesses, I have always had a business that serves the season in life that I'm in and that's been a really beautiful thing.
So my business and working for myself has taken me from being a young, solopreneur, pretty unattached and able to travel and do fun things with my work. To being a mother who wanted to scale her business slowly and sustainably so I could be with my kids as they grew. To honestly, this season like having the kind of business that has grown and flourished in a pandemic while also being able to be present with my kids while they're home all the time.
That's the biggest win for me because that's what I stand for and what I talk about. So the fact that I get to live it too, is really important to me.
Ellie: That's so cool. I love what you've pointed out there. This is now your second business. So you have had a phase of business for going back several years now that has fit exactly where you are and that's the magic of entrepreneurship. You get to make it work for you. And it can be so easy sometimes to forget that, but when we remember and really are intentional about it, that is magic. It's pure magic to work for ourselves and to make things happen for ourselves the way we want it to
Ashley: Yeah. And I sometimes think we forget that those are wins. I think sometimes the bigger flashier things like. Hitting big revenue goals or being able to take lots of time off feel, like I think a lot of people would answer that question on the biggest one. That way it's really important to reflect for me and say actually the big wins are much smaller.
It's the ability to go for my trail, runs all the time and take the yoga class in the middle of the day and take a break cause my daughter wants to do something together in the middle of the day. Like those are the things that really make the difference and allowing myself to celebrate those and acknowledge them as wins is huge.
Ellie: Yes!
I'm sitting here, like fangirling because I'm getting there in part from following you for so long and also through some other coaching. But it's also something that it's taken me quite a long time to get to. And I'm not somebody who's really great at dwelling on any wins. So like sitting here going "yes, I've gotten it to the point where if I want to, I can run my business in three days a week." Like I could just walk away and have two days off a week if I wanted to. If I wasn't trying to create a second business, I would, I work three days a week.
Ashley: That's like the pivot there, like the reframe there. It's like how beautiful that your core business allows you to do it in just three days a week so you have the spaciousness and the creative, energy to launch the second business, like so cool.
Ellie: I know it is incredible. And it feels sometimes very surreal that I now have a business that I'm making enough money in and that business at this stage, and running it for just about three years now is so streamlined because I've put in all this time through all the things we've talking about, the right templates and tools and software that it does run pretty easily.
Ashley: Yeah. And it gives you a choice. I think that's something that I deeply value is that my business gives me choice into how I spend my time and structure my days. And it gives me choice what I can create. I think that's so fun.
Ellie: I 100% agree, but I can't help myself from laughing right now because all I can think is that sort of all the time that I would spend outside my business, has sort of been taken away this year.
My choice would be to go home back to America. My choice would be to go out with friends more. My choice would be to do all these things because I'm quite extroverted and really like those types of things. But, yes. I have built a business that will allow those things in a non-pandemic year.
Ashley: Yes. Yeah. Those choices have definitely been stripped away, but I love that choice piece. Like your business allows you, the choice of , like maybe in a non- pandemic year, you would want to take more of that time off and travel and do things with friends. But in this year it's like the choice is, what I've left with is I'm going to pour it back into a second business.
Ellie: Exactly. Actually, I'm very excited. We are hoping to come home for six weeks next year. Essentially Memorial Day to 4th of July, if it's allowing.
So what would you say has been your biggest mistake or learning experience in your time as an entrepreneur?
Ashley: I could probably come up with quite a few here, but I think a lot of it came down to trusting other people more than I trust myself. And I really do value having mentors and people who are farther along with you and educators and everything to take information from. But I think early on what I forgot to do was process it and decide is this right for me? Do I want to take this in and implement it in my business and do it my own way?
I would just take people's advice for what it is, I would just implement. Like with the service design is a great example. When someone said best way to grow your business is to go from one-to-one to one-to-many as quickly as you can.
I definitely started walking down that path until I was like, "no, this is so not the way I want to grow." And I think that was the moment and that learning experience for me, it was like, yes, I could do this. Yes. This is a model that's working for many coaches. But it's not a model that I'm really interested in pursuing.
And so that was when I started learning to get the information, then trust myself as much as I'm trusting other people.
Ellie: Yes. I think that there's something really interesting about the self-trust thing, because it can be challenging enough as just a human to do self-trust. It can be really challenging as a woman to do self-trust because we have been essentially conditioned into being experts about caring for everybody, but ourselves.
And then you throw in entrepreneurship, which is just a mess on top of that for anybody. And so it's being a human, being a woman, being an entrepreneur, and then learning to trust yourself through all of that. Especially when there's so many unknowns sometimes in that, and it can be really challenging, but you're right.
It's completely essential to getting it right for you and to feeling peace with our choices and our business, and like I'm sure that when you decided to walk back and say, no, I'm not doing that one-to-many thing for right now. I'm sure you felt like, I guess the word you've used quite a lot. So it's here in my brain right now is friction.
You probably felt a lot more at ease and a lot less of that friction. When you went over it, I've made the right call. Like I know it, I've trusted myself and I've done it.
Ashley: Yeah, full transparency not right away. Like it actually took me awhile because I could see a lot of other people having success with that model. So there had to be an element of patience. And like you said about yourself, I'm not great with patience, but there had to be this element where I was like, I'm choosing this model for the time being.
I know that there are other ways that my business can evolve. I do not know what those are yet. But I'm trusting that if I stick with this model for the time being, I will figure those things out. Honestly, it's not a super comfortable place to be, but I knew that it was the right thing to do. So I decided to just sit in the discomfort and allow things to unfold.
And I think that's probably a really great learning experience because I've had to do that multiple times in business.
Ellie: Absolutely, for sure. And I think that's a really good point is that by second guessing ourselves or not feeling necessarily immediately at peace with something doesn't mean we've made the wrong call.
Ashley: Yeah, it just means solutions on the way.
Ellie: Right. You can still sit in that place of self-trust and still be in a place of like slight discomfort. I think that sums up a lot of entrepreneurship, to be
honest.
Ashley: I think it's every day, right? Even when you've arrived at success. And even when you have the simple, streamlined business serving the life, like all that stuff, there's still plenty of moments for discomfort and growth and trusting yourself. Like they're always there.
Ellie: I think every time that I think about, okay, how much am I going to invest? Not even always monetarily, in this next thing that I want to do I think, but that's always discomfort. Because it's growth. There's always this comfort in the face of growth that way.
Ashley: Yeah. And you can choose to coast and ride steady and there are some seasons where that feels really good. And it's great to do that, but then I generally find that most high-achieving entrepreneurial, creative types are going to go back to. Okay. What do I want to do to challenge myself a little bit?
Ellie: Yeah. Yeah. I don't think very often the people that are doing this are the people that are really good sitting still that way.
Ashley: Yeah. And I like to think about in my work with my clients and even like how I model it on my own business, like how do we do that thing where we're striving and we are achieving next level goals, but in a way that's easeful and full of intention. And not from that like hustle, hustle, hustle, mentality,
and that takes a lot of work.
Ellie: yeah. That's something I've been working on as well. I think it's, it is an art almost. It's definitely an art.
Ashley: Yeah. And a practice, right?
Ellie: Oh, I think art is a practice.
Ashley: Yeah.
Ellie: So is there anything else that you want to say or any resources you want to point people to?
Ashley: I think, like you said, I have a podcast called Better Than Big. And while we talk about many components of running a business, that's simple and streamlined and life-giving, I think we do talk about service design a lot.
And so if you're looking for ideas, there was even a season, I think it was maybe the September episodes, where I talked about different business models and why you might choose them. And so if you're really interested in that, you might go back and listen to those episodes.
And if you just want to reach out and connect, you can go to my website, ashleygartland.com. There's loads of resources there, but feel free to email me, fill out the contact form. If anything's resonating with you. If you have questions, I'm always available.
Ellie: Perfect. And I'll make sure to put your website and your Instagram in the show notes for people. All right. It's been so good having you here. I hope you have for those of you who aren't here with us at the moment, this is right before Christmas. So Ashley I hope you have a lovely holiday period and I can't wait to hopefully reconnect as we release this episode in 2020.
Ashley: Yeah, thank you so much for having me. This was a delight.
Ellie: Thank you for listening to The Capable Collective podcast. I really hope that you've enjoyed all the value that you've gotten from this episode. If you've enjoyed it please go ahead and subscribe and leave a review if you're listening over on Apple podcasts. It means the world to little podcast when we're first getting started. It can really help other people find this information and this value. Thank you so much again, have a great day.
